My response to this post has been deleted by the administrators. Meshing Consulting Services Ltd. is ripping off their visa customers by charging them more than five times the actual cost of a visa obtained through normal channels. It is much cheaper to go to Hong Kong to get the same visa for 1020 HKD rather than 5400 RMB through Meshing.

Why would this forum delete truthful posts about fraudulent activity by a company which is preying on vulnerable victims. Could it be they are receiving payola for Meshing?

Dude,
Maybe they delete you because you make like 5 responses or you post the visa prices in like 4 different threads.
It's true, meshing services charge some serious cash, but they provide a service. I've purchased FVisas through meshing services in the past and they've been completely open about finding cheaper rates in Hong Kong. Only problem is, going to Hong Kong and staying there for a day or two ends up being just as expensive.
Bummer that you got ripped of, but I think most people are quite aware that a year-long visa doesn't actually cost 5400 RMB, but they're willing to spend it because they have lots of cash or little time, both or maybe they're just lazy and can't be bothered to travel 1000s of km for a visa.

Dannyrogue,

The multiple postings were due to the fact that the local web police blocked this website after one of my recent posts, and I was obliged to access it through a very slow proxy server which stuttered when I posted the notice above. Unfotunately there is no way for users to delete their own posts on this site, so it was up to the editors to remove the multiple postings. As for the information about Meshing, this was crossposted in every thread which mentioned this agency favorably, including the blurb above from the Shanghaiist which calls it a "favorite visa agency," and I did the same thing with my most on CTS in all threads which recommended using them in Hong Kong. Both agencies are engaging in fraudulent practices, and anyone tempted to use either should know this before the spend their hard earned cash unnecessarily. My issue is with those who promote these agencies as "honest" or "reliable" whithout telling the whole story.

There are now plenty of ways for applicants to obtain F visa renewals locally or in another Chinese local without using the services of such opportunists, and the process in Hong Kong is even faster and more transparent. For those in southern China the trip to Hong Kong and overnighting there to wait for a rush visa processed through the government office I referred to in my post about CTS will end up costing much less than the 5400 RMB Meshing is charging. My recent trip to Hong Kong cost around $500 USD including airfare and two nights in a hotel. Furthermore, if you have been in China for so long that paying exhorbitant fees to those who exploit the vulnerabilities of the expat population and engage in fraudulent or corrupt practices seems "normal" or "necessary," you have probably been in China too long and could use a trip to Hong Kong, where the rule of law still generally prevails, to free yourself from the Stockholm Syndrome.

For those who decide to pay such fees knowing full well that they are contributing to the problem they are trying to solve, fine. I prefer to travel a bit further to avoid feeding the machine.

Dannyrogue,

The multiple postings were due to the fact that the local web police blocked this website after one of my recent posts, and I was obliged to access it through a very slow proxy server which stuttered when I posted the notice above. Unfortunately there is no way for users to delete their own posts on this site, so it was up to the editors to remove the multiple postings. As for the information about Meshing, this was crossposted in every thread which mentioned this agency favorably, including the blurb above from the Shanghaiist which calls it a "favorite visa agency," and I did the same thing with my post on CTS in all threads which recommended using them in Hong Kong. Both agencies are engaging in fraudulent practices --period-- and anyone tempted to use their services should know this before they spend their hard earned cash unnecessarily. My issue is not with those who use these agencies out of laziness or desperation but with those who promote them as "honest" or "reliable" whithout telling the whole story. For all those who decide to pay such fees knowing full well that they are contributing to the problem they are trying to solve, fine. I prefer to travel a bit further to avoid feeding the machine.

There are now plenty of ways for applicants to obtain F visa renewals locally or in another Chinese locale without using the services of such opportunists, but the process in Hong Kong is faster and more transparent. For those living in southern China, the trip to Hong Kong and overnighting there to wait for a rush visa processed through the government office I referred to in my post about CTS will end up costing much less than the 5400 RMB Meshing is charging. (My recent trip to Hong Kong cost around $500 USD including airfare and two nights in a hotel.) Furthermore, if you have been in China for so long that paying exhorbitant fees to those who exploit the vulnerabilities of the expat population and engage in fraudulent or corrupt practices seems "normal" or "necessary" in order for you to continue residing here without fear of being shaken down by the local PSB, you could probably use a trip to Hong Kong, where the rule of law still generally prevails, to free yourself from the Stockholm Syndrome.

Harmornious,
Man it's a bummer that you got burned, but you're criticizing people for trying to make a buck, which is really just what everyone around the world is trying to do at the moment (and throughout history). It's not really the Meshing Service's fault that people are willing to pay so much. Also, let's not rule out that, with everything in China, there's some bargaining going on during the transaction.
It is generally understood that things in China are a bit more expensive for foreigners than locals. Foreigners, generally, have more disposable income given that most ex-pats have jobs that afford them a lifestyle that many Chinese can not even comprehend. But honestly, if you think that Hong Kong is in some way less corrupt than the mainland, you are sadly mistaken. Just because a couple people speak English, they call their currency dollars and you can eat a solid fish in chips doesn't make Hong Kong the beacon of purity.
Stop bein' such a hater.

I think it's OK for Harmonious to give information to other people who are not very familiar with all the facts... Meshing guys are heavily advertised and praised by this and other websites, it makes it really looks like perfect choice, but it's really a rip-off... I don't know what is the reason for such a praise, maybe it's paid advertise or so.

Many foreigners have no idea about other options and they just end up paying those crazy high charges, which they wouldn't do if they have more information, of course.
(not all foreigners in China are managers, bankers or architects)

Last week I gave suggestion to my European friends, and they flew Hangzhou-Shenzhen (really cheap), finished China visa in Hong Kong (hundreds of agencies and guesthouses offer visa service, of course not CTS), had wonderful time in HK city for sightseeing and shopping, and all that for lower price than Meshing...

I don't say that everybody should do this, of course if you have more cash and little time then you would choose expensive (and more convenient) option.
But, for other people who like to save money or have time and like to enjoy travel, HK comes as great option.

Maybe Harmonious was little bit too harsh with words, but anyway I don't see reason for Dannyrouge's bad comments about Hong Kong... corruption comparison sounds unreal.

Wish you all Happy New Year,
sallecc

sallec,
I think people like Meshing because they seem to be updated on the visa situation more than anybody else. As an information resource, they are great. I have never used them for actually getting a visa before, but I definitely have used them a lot to get answers for what the latest story is for China visas.

Once again, harmornious' posts are misleading. The visas offered by Meshing are NOT available in Hong Kong. There is nowhere in HK to get a one year multi-entry F visa. If I'm wrong tell me, I'd love to be able to get one. I've asked every agency I know. Yes, RMB5000+ is a lot of money, and it's too much for me, but as far as I can establish no-one else anywhere is offering these visas.
Harmornious has seen the price list on the wall of the visa office in HK and simply assumed that all the visas it lists are available. If he/she had bothered to ask the staff, he/she would have discovered that the list covers all conceivable visa types; the availability varies from time to time, and one year visas are most certainly not available to the casual applicant at present.
The situation with visas is difficult, frustrating and confusing, and it doesn't help to have numpties like harmornious failing to do very basic research, making misleading posts here, and insulting people like Meshing who provide a genuine and much needed service as well as the moderators of this forum. None of us knows what Meshing's profit margin is, but they're obviously professional and competent.

Zangdook,
You should check your own research more carefully before attempting to discredit those of us who actually bother to investigate things. Here is the relevent information from the Comissioner's Office of China's Foreign Ministry, which also coincides with the information posted on the wall: http://www.fmcoprc.gov.hk/eng/zgqz/blsjfy/

"Processing time and visa fees (Hong Kong dollars in cash only) 2008-09-24
Individual Visa
Single visa
HK$150
Double visa
HK$220
Multiple (6 months)
HK$400
Multiple (12/24/36 months)
HK$600
Visa Transference
HK$100
Additional Charge for Expedited Service (Individual Visa)
Express Service
HK$150 /person
Rush Service
HK$250 /person
List of Countries on Reciprocal Basisof Visa Fees
Country Single Double Multiple (6 months) Multiple (12 months)
AMERICA 1020 1020 1020 1020"

In your second paragraph you allude to the real reason why you were denied a one-year, multiple entry visa valid for 90 days:

"I can tell you for an absolute fact that a US or European citizen going in there with no more documentation that passport, application form, photo and cash will not get a visa that can be counted in years, or anything like 90-day per visit validity."

FYI, if that is all the documentation you had, you are not eligible for an F visa period, and you can count yourself as lucky to have received one at all. An F visa requires a letter from an employer or Chinese company inviting the applicant to visit. Without such a letter you have no right to an F visa. CTS and other agencies get around this requirement by drafting "letters" for applicants when in fact they have no legal right to do so, and this is why they charge so much for their services. Here are the required documents for F visa applications:
http://www.fmcoprc.gov.hk/eng/zgqz/qzlb/
"2. F visa for business and visit
(1) Visa Notification Form, or an letter issued by the company he/she is employed and the registration license of this company, or an invitation letter from the mainland company ant the registration license of this company.
(2) Under some circumstances, the applicants may be required to provide financial proof, a copy of Chinese hotel booking and return flight ticket booking."

It seems that when you say "the longest visas available from that office were..." you are referring to applicants who did not have the required documents, including the letter. If you can cite a single example of a US citizen -- I can't speak to what other nationalities may encounter -- who presented the all of the required documentation but was denied a one-year visa or a longer maximum stay than 30 days, that would indeed contradict the stated policy of the ministry and would be a cause to file a complaint with the US Consulate in Hong Kong. In the absence of such a case you can only assume that the reason the shorter validity visas and maximum stays were granted was because the applicants really didn't qualify for an F visa in the first place.

I'm not sure what a "numpty" is but if providing timely and accurate information makes me one, I guess I am.

More dishonesty from 'harmornious'.
My post was perfectly clear. The 12, 24 and 36 month visas are not available to ordinary applicants, whether for an L or an F visa. My understanding is that they *are* available for applicants with permanent residence in Hong Kong, (although I haven't obtained confirmation of that from the authorities) and it is presumably for their benefit that the prices are displayed.
The idea that, if they won't give you a 36-month visa despite listing a price for one, you have cause to complain to the US Consulate is so ridiculous it's not even funny.
Merely listing the price for a visa does not imply that that category of visa is available to all nationalities.

'harmornious' writes:
"It seems that when you say "the longest visas available from that office were..." you are referring to applicants who did not have the required documents"

no, dear, I mean exactly what I say. 12-month visas whether L or F, are not available to ordinary citizens of Western countries. To suggest I was saying 'you won't get a visa without your paperwork' when I was clearly saying something quite different is not just dishonest, it's idiotic.

NOTE: This all relates to the situation in January when the above exchange took place - things may have changed.

I wonder when 'harmornious' will apologise to all the people he/she has misled and insulted.